Adnan Virk and Jason Demers recently launched NHL Unscripted, from iHeart Media in partnership with the NHL, in early December. They’ve put out eight episodes so far, featuring guests that include current and former NHL players (Jordan Martinook, Nate Thompson), broadcasters (Vegas Golden Knights’ Spanish-language voice Jesus Lopez), celebrity hockey fans (The Kid Mero, Metal Blade Records CEO Brian Slagel), and more.
Virk recently spoke to Awful Announcing about the podcast, which releases new episodes each Thursday. He said it came out of an old ESPN connection and was the next podcasting fit for him after the end of his Cinephile movie podcast.
‘I had Cinephile for a long time, it was a podcast for seven years, and that was a blast, we did 333 episodes. But unfortunately, my contract was not renewed by Meadowlark Media. I kept it going for a while literally pro bono just because I love movies so much, but then I thought ‘This is kind of pointless,’ so I decided to hang it up. And then I got a call from Vince Kates, an old friend from ESPN, he was Colin Cowherd’s long-time producer, and he said to me, ‘Listen, I’m with iHeart now and I’m looking to put together a podcast in partnership with the NHL.'”
At that point, Virk was primarily working for MLB Network, and mostly only doing NHL Network work in the MLB offseason. But he also had an offer to work for Amazon’s Prime Video on their Monday Night Hockey NHL package in Canada, which he revealed to the team looking to put together this podcast, and that helped clinch it for him. Then they asked who he’d want to potentially work with. Virk first threw out some names of people he worked with at NHLN, but that seemed possibly challenging given their schedules, so another name came to mind.
“I said, ‘Well, the guy who I hear great things about who I’m not actually working with yet is Jason Demers. Everyone tells me he’s terrific. He’s funny, he’s colorful, he’s well-rounded, his wife’s an actress, so we can talk movies. He’s got lots of things to say, and he’s obviously a very bright guy.’ So we hopped on a Zoom and they all chatted together and said ‘Yeah, let’s do this.”
Virk said pairing with Demers has worked out even better than he expected.
“JD is a great guy. He’s very funny. He’s very colorful. He has no shortage of opinions,” Virk said. “I had asked one of our producers, Steve Tronzano, one of our coordinating producers at NHL Network, and I asked him ‘I gave these guys a few names, but they’re all very busy; who are you thinking?’ And Tronz actually said to me ‘I think Demers would be really good.’ And I said, ‘You know, I’ve watched him on TV, and there’s a couple of things that stand out.'”
“One of which is he just retired, and it’s really helpful when you have a guy who just literally hung up the skates. There’s no team, there’s no locker room that Jason Demers is not familiar with. can go into a locker room and know a handful of players or assistant coaches or clubbies, whoever. I think that connection to the game is incredibly helpful because you can tell anecdotes with everyone, having just been on the ice.”
Virk said Demers’ unique takes and sense of humor are key to making this podcast stand out in a crowded landscape.
“And having seen him in his work, I said ‘What’s the most important thing with podcasts?’ As you and I know, it’s a very cluttered space. It’s so unusual with podcasts: I think they’re oversaturated and there’s too many podcasts out there, and yet the majority of podcast listeners are of a certain age or demographic or whatever it may be may be. It’s kind of like the opposite of linear television, which is mostly older people who have not cut cable. Podcasts are for the younger generation, yet there’s so many podcasts out there you can’t keep up. So the question becomes ‘How do you cut through the space? How do you find something unique?'”
“And what I found with JD, again, the fact he was just off the ice, he was definitely outspoken, which I think is really important when it comes to podcasts, you have to be liberated, and again, the fact that he was well-rounded. I quickly found that there is no topic that he does not have an opinion on. He’s genuinely funny. He’s easy to work with. He’s got a real charm about him. And he’s really been a natural fit. As you know with podcasts, I don’t think you can replicate chemistry, it’s probably the hardest thing to find, but right out of the gate, we have it.”
But Virk recognizes the challenges of launching a new sports podcast with so many already out there.
“I think it’s incredibly difficult. Even I myself, as a consumer of podcasts who enjoys podcasts, I can’t possibly keep up. If I just listen to podcasts with friends, I can’t keep up, right? I mean, even though I’m no longer a full-time employer or a contract employee with Meadowlark, I still show up on a freelance basis, so I try ti keep up with those guys. But if I just listen to the Meadowlark podcasts, I can’t keep up. I listen to Pablo [Torre], I listen to Roy Bellamy’s hockey show, which is great fun. But that’s just one company: I can’t listen to that and all of the Ringer pods or The Volume’s pods. There’s just no way.”
He said something helpful here is the backing they have from iHeart and the NHL.
“One thing that was very attractive to me is that it is not only an NHL initiative, but it’s iHeart. They’re the number one distributor of podcasts in Canada and America. So this is not some fly-by-night outfit, this is a big-time company. My sister-in-law was asking me about the podcast, and I said, ‘Well, it’s with iHeart,’ and she’s like ‘I know what iHeart is!’ That brand recognition is helpful.”
And Virk said it’s useful that there aren’t a ton of NHL podcasts covering the whole league.
“Now whether we can cut through the space, that remains to be seen. Can we carve out a niche? We’ll see. But one thing I also felt confident about, reasonably so, is that there’s not a ton of great hockey podcasts out there. I think everyone knows the popularity of Spittin’ Chiclets, I think, especially in Canada, people know 32 Thoughts with Elliotte Friedman, but there’s not a ton, it’s not like there’s 20 [national] NHL podcasts. There’s a few that I think are very good, but there’s not a ton. So I feel like if you’re a hardcore hockey fan, there’s still enough of a market out there that we can tap into, hopefully.
“The hardest thing, I think, will be just awareness. I think if someone says, ‘Oh, I didn’t know you had a podcast,’ that’s the biggest challenge. If they say ‘Oh, you have a podcast, let me give it a listen,’ and if you listen, you go, ‘Hey, I certainly like Jason Demers, I’ve always liked Adnan Virk, these guys know their hockey, but they’re also funny, and Adnan’s sprinkling in his movie reviews and they’re talking about plane etiquette and other nonsense, and hey, this is pretty good.'”
He said their guests are also a key part of the strategy, and they’ve been great so far.
“I think also having good guests is helpful. We had [Metal Blade founder and CEO] Brian Slagel on the podcast, who was the guy who founded Metallica, and he’s a huge hockey fan. At one point, he had season tickets to five different teams. I asked ‘How could you possibly even have the time go to five different teams’ home games?’ But he had Ducks’ tickets, Kings’ tickets, and more, and now he’s just a Vegas Golden Knights’ ticketholder. And as my friend Dan Sanders told me years ago, someone may come for the guest, but they stay for the hosts. I think if people actually give us a shot, we can cut through the space; there’s not a ton of competition and if people give us a chance, hopefully they like what they hear.”
And then there’s that NHL partnership. That certainly might carry some concerns for some of “Will this be only positive about the league?”, but Virk said the partnership’s more about the league promoting it and helping them line up guests.
“I think basically what it means is that we’ve got their support and their promotional reach. So I think what that means is that if we say ‘Hey, we’d love to get Jon Hamm involved, he’s going to be at the Winter Classic,’ somebody at the NHL can put us in touch with him. I think it utilizes NHL resources. And because it’s in partnership with iHeart and it’s from the NHL, hey, I’m not necessarily calling Gary Bettman, but if we wanted to, we could do that, or have Bill Daly on, or George Parros or whoever.
“It’s something if you’re just doing a hockey podcast on its own, that’s a big challenge, but it’s iHeart, which is a major distributor, and it’s in partnership with the league, they can say ‘Oh, okay, we can definitely tap into the resources and hopefully get you some league guests.’ And it goes both ways, right? ‘Winter Classic is coming up, can you guys promote it with guest X, Y, or Z?’ I think that’s definitely a positive.”
Virk said he understands why there might be some skepticism of a league-partnered podcast, but he said he’s well-accustomed to that from his years working for MLB Network and NHL Network. And he said the restrictions on what you can say on those networks aren’t necessarily what people think.
“I remember years ago when I started at MLB Network, I was talking with Rob McGlarry, our boss, and said, ‘What does it mean when you work for MLBN? People are going to say ‘You’ve going to be careful what you say.’ And he had the only advice which I’ve ever really thought about: ‘If you’re going to criticize someone, a team specifically, never make it personal. Never criticize, you know, Pittsburgh Pirates’ ownership, specifically.’
“I might say, ‘Hey, it’d be nice for the Pirates to spend because Paul Skenes is a great young pitcher and the window may be limited because eventually he’ll hit free agency and be so expensive, I’d love to see the Pirates spend.’ That’s fine. But I think if you’re critical of a certain team or the league, it’s different. Similarly, if we say in a given game ‘Hey, this umpire blew this call, that’s unfortunate, in a World Series game,’ it happens. But if I was to criticize and go on a crusade against league-wide officiating, like how Jeff Van Gundy was particularly pointed towards officials, then it becomes a different issue.”
And overall, he’s thrilled to be doing this podcast and expanding his hockey work.
“It’s really helped me doing a lot more hockey now. I was doing NHL Network in the offseason, but now doing the Monday games and now also doing a podcast, it’s really been a blast.”
